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I almost gave up with Kyle Heebner – Episode 72

3 top tips from Kyle Heebner:

1.Always remember why you do what you do.

One thing I think of is just always remembering why you do what you do. Yeah, what got you into the business that you do? And try, try to keep that passion alive. Try to keep that drive and passion alive. Yeah, I know. It’s not easy. I know. I’ve lost mine. Quite a few times throughout me. Because backward once you realize, get out of that little pit and back into I love this. I do this. Come on, and we’ve got to go. Yeah, that’s I think that’s, that’s one thing.

2. Always try not to take money as a priority or try to prioritize the encounter money to make money.

Always try not to take money as your priority, or try to prioritize the encounter the money to make money, money, money, and just keep at it. Okay, what do you love about what you do? And people see that? Yeah, it comes out to you. That joy and the passion you have for whatever it is you do. Other do what I do help kids, pediatrics, your mechanic where your construction, whatever you do, and you show that passion? It’s like, yeah, I want to use this company. I will use that person. I feel the, you know, financially, of course, all we all need to survive financially, and we want to thrive financially. And I feel that having that positive attitude is loving what you do. I think that leads to thriving financially.

3. Never stop learning.

It’s a big caveat. I heard you say that you always slow down. And always listen to people around you, and being in business, listen to your staff asking them questions instead of us just blabbing away and sit down, relax, and listen to what they’re saying. Because we also learn so much from our staff and our team. And that leads to helping us with decision-making as well.


Debra Chantry Taylor



integrator, business, visionary, piece, eos, meetings, people, Scott, hire, bit, implementer, hats, company, therapy, person, services, hiring process, interrogator, sell, seats

Kyle Heebner  00:00

I got that burnout. Still worse like, Oh man, this isn’t working or too many competitors out that you know, whatever it may be. Yeah. Should I still continue doing this?

Debra Chantry-Taylor  00:09

So, Good Morning and welcome to another episode of Better Business, Better Life. Today, I’m joined by Kyle Heebner who was actually joining me from Pennsylvania. So it’s afternoon for him. Good afternoon. Kyle has has come to me through a very good friend of mine, Scott Rusnak, and he is the founder and visionary of HM Therapy Support Services. And I’ll let you tell let him tell you a bit more about that. But welcome, Kyle, lovely to have you here.

Kyle Heebner  00:33

Yeah, thank you, Debra. And thank you for the invitation.

Debra Chantry-Taylor  00:37

Yeah, we’ve just been having a chat beforehand, obviously. And I’m really looking forward to sharing some of your stories here with the listeners. So let’s get started. Why don’t you tell us a little bit about yourself and your business and perhaps give us a professional and personal best?

Kyle Heebner  00:51

Yeah, so business is YALI state, it’s HM, systems, HM therapy. And we provide pediatric therapy services, we help kiddos that have physical disabilities, emotional issues. And we have two business models with that. One is called early intervention. So, that’s for kiddos from the ages zero to three, and we service in their homes to help support not just little kids, but the families. And then the other business model, we provide school based services, and that is Pre-K through the grade of 12, 12 grade kiddos. And the therapy services includes physical therapy, occupational therapy, speech therapy, psychology service, behavioral services. And throughout the years, you know that that’s booked up more, I’m an occupational therapist, myself, my awesome wife Alice is on the team, she made that move back in 2007 or 2008. And we gradually built from there to add the additional therapy services.

Debra Chantry-Taylor  02:03

Okay, so when was the business actually started? Because I, you know, heard your story, you became an occupational therapist, when did you start your business?

Kyle Heebner  02:10

The business started in 2005. And we started as early intervention therapists, and we just just me by traveling to different people’s homes, so that part time and also work in schools for for the schools themselves at that time. And then I was asked to word of mouth, I was asked from one district take if you help out. And so I started to work in the schools. And, again, word of mouth, I didn’t put too much into the marketing piece at that point in time. And more and more schools started asking for services, and then it kind of gradually built up from there.

Debra Chantry-Taylor  02:50

And I’m writing and saying you’ve got about 50 full time employees now is that right?

Kyle Heebner  02:56

Exactly. Yeah. And again, that that, grad, I always say it’s a healthy, healthy growth, that gradual growth was not too big of a boom or overwhelmed and hit off the seats, but a healthy growth throughout the years, which is that nice gradual growth. And you know, every year throughout since 2005, we’ve we’ve had gross income grow every year, except for for one year, 2013 and 2014. And just flat, it was pretty flat, flat down. And that had to do with a well actually personal thing. It was an accident. I was in a motorcycle accident in 2012. And so it’s 2013 where the income kind of flattened out went down just a little bit. But yeah, throughout throughout the years, we had healthy growth.

Debra Chantry-Taylor  03:49

Yeah. Fabulous. So personal professional, best. What are you most proud of in your personal life in your professional life?

Kyle Heebner  03:57

Well, that’s a tough one for personally, so please think about thanks a blast. Every day. That I guess silly one. Yeah, I just turned 53 just had a birthday. Yeah. Yeah, thank you. And I guess a piece of that is, you know, still able to, to physically stay so active. I love snowboarding, biking, running, hiking, and still being able to be physically active. And business. And you know, I can say we discussed really briefly before, and my company was acquired a few months ago. And so that’s that’s an that’s an easy one. fairly quick there in the business side. Yes, a business was purchased a few months ago.

Debra Chantry-Taylor  04:50

Yeah, that’s right. Yes. And so that’s an interesting one is it was that was the plan or did that sort of come out of the business over time?

Kyle Heebner  05:01

Yeah, that’s a really good question. Because I don’t know about most other people in business, but, you know, it’s always ups and downs with the the the challenges, and you love what you do. But then, you know, I’ve been in the business for quite a few years. Sorry, 2005. But yeah, I know a few times throughout the years, you start as I got that burnout still, where it’s like, oh, man, this isn’t working or, you know, hiring or too many competitors out that you know, whatever it may be. Yeah. Should I still continue doing this? And you’re back? Yeah, maybe I should try to sell. So it thought came to mind a few times throughout the years. And then it was kind of a, it’s such an interesting time, specially with COVID. Everything else happening? 2020. So even with that, we had such a mix. But I should say I had such a mix emotionally going through that process. Because yeah, we get hit with COVID of the world, which was not a good thing and so many challenges for everyone. Then September, August, September of that year, I hired some amazing, amazing people for the admin and internal piece of the team. And so yeah, we started picking up. And that’s when the thinking of EOS Yeah, that’s when we got the the visionary, visionary here. minds always running and rolling. And thank God. Again, her name is Tricia, the integrator. And sorry, if I mess up this meeting, but I made up a name. I call it her interrogator integrator.

Debra Chantry-Taylor  06:59

She’s probably both right.

Kyle Heebner  07:00

So EOS, Scott you love that to the interrogator. And yeah, if things were going, man, things are going awesome. But yeah, we also were hit with, you know, everybody talked about 2020 being hit with the pandemic. But the business side 2021, you know, the first half of 2021 was just amazing. Second half, and we really started filling, we’re getting hit with many challenges at the company. So that was one piece, where it’s like, Yeah, is this the right, this is the right time to go to move forward with this process? When I had some people asking me, if I was interested in moving for selling, and you’re starting the process, discussion of selling 2021 We was thinking, you know, what, this will be a learning experience, probably will not sell probably will not move forward, but it’ll be a learning experience. But uh, yeah, we ended up moving forward with with the deal, and we did it.

Debra Chantry-Taylor  08:19

Yeah. And I can imagine as the visionary, you’re probably already thinking about the next idea. And what’s next right?

Kyle Heebner  08:26

I am I am.

Debra Chantry-Taylor  08:29

Understand that you’re not you know, that you’re still there in the current business, but I know how visionaries minds work. And that was really interesting. We had a bit of a chat and before we came on board about the fact that one of the things that you really liked about EOS was suddenly this discovery of this visionary and integrator piece. And so this is something you’d not heard of before before you came across us.

Kyle Heebner  08:51

Not not not to that extent. You know, where it’s like, you know, throughout the years I add up here Yeah, I need to hire here and you know, you’re here. I need to hire here. I need to take off some hats. But yeah, until Scott came on with EOS, yeah, it was. Yeah, we get your visionary is where your mindset, you need somebody here as the integrator, and you know, I didn’t I didn’t quite get time. I was like, Yeah, that sounds that sounds good. Maybe we’ll take ass off at Yeah, I don’t think so. But uh, yeah, we were we started going that route and is speaking hats. Yeah, it was like, a cool I could take this hat off. Nice. It take this hat off. And it’s, it’s, I feel it’s such an important piece to any business owner. And, like, I think you may have said earlier where as a business owner, we feel kind of lost and alone in many, many cases, I know I’ve felt that way many times throughout the years. Because those people have no no idea what’s going on with business and what we’re dealing with and some of the challenges we have. But yeah, adding the integrator. Yeah, that’s miss, like miracle piece happening. And again, the right person, yeah, the right people the right seat, you get that integrator, and it is someone that, you know, as a  veteran, explain me with just that specialty mindset of, you know, operations. And, you know, kind of taking that taking that charge. It’s huge.

Debra Chantry-Taylor  10:48

So tell me, because Trisha is your integrator, is that, right?

Kyle Heebner  10:53

So it’s sad to say, I miss our meetings, and every day was.

Debra Chantry-Taylor  11:03

So tell me did how did you find her because she wasn’t in the business while she brought her in from externally? Is that right?

Kyle Heebner  11:12

Yeah, exactly. Yeah, that is correct. I hesitated there a little bit we had and like I said, earlier, we fall summer 2020 2020. And we had three, four or four amazing hires, at that timeframe, and all internally, so we’re always hiring service members, therapists to work business. But they she she was a I work with her early 2000s School District. And another person Her name is Julie, I work with her school district round that same timeframe, San Diego city schools and we haven’t connected in a while, but I got Julie on the team. I pulled her from another big company. And that was Jude Rockstar. And then if she was communicating with Trisha, and I would say yes, I knew the company, Trisha was with a telhealth company, huge company. And so yeah, she she has a good position. She’s gonna stay there. I think after Julie, she connected with her and yeah, we were able to get her on the team and Tricia ended up the becoming HM, my company, HM Therapy integrator, or interrogator?

Debra Chantry-Taylor  12:41

And tell me a little bit about that relationship. Because I suppose for some people, this might be quite a novel concept as a sole visionary integrator thing. So tell me a little about what what what was that relationship like for you? And how did it help you as a visionary? To have that person as your right hand person?

Kyle Heebner  12:57

Yeah. And, Scott, you know, that Scott was my EOS implementer. Coach. And yeah, he was he was key piece in that because he was helping to record guide positions, is, I don’t know about other people out there. But you as business owner, and the hats are so many hats, and like, I can’t get rid of this. I’m gonna transcend, or I’m gonna, like person knows about this. I’ve heard keep this a lot better keep it say you kind of have to, like need to hold on everything. And so yeah, it was was a good gradual process. And where, as Scott, we can point different things out, whether it be marketing or staffing, sells relationships with some of the contracts that she was taking on some of those areas. And, like, sweet Yeah, she’s got it. She kicks butt at it. And good, good to go. So yeah, I guess I don’t have any magic like, Yeah, we did this, these specific things. But it was Zack good, gradual process to where you took this, these tasks or this piece of the business. And another piece of the business kind of went on, from there to where you have freed me up a lot to then be able to focus on other areas of business. That makes sense.

Debra Chantry-Taylor  14:42

Yeah, no, absolutely does. I think that’s what EOS is all about giving some structure that can help you to take things forward and the time to, to focus on the things that you’re really good at. So we talked again at the beginning. One of the things you said you loved about EOS was the level 10 meetings and as a visionary meetings usually aren’t high on our list of things that we love, either. So, tell me a little bit about your journey with EOS and these level 10 meetings and what they did for you.

Kyle Heebner  15:10

Yeah, like you brought up earlier to actually, I miss those those meetings. Yeah. We had such an awesome team, Dream Team, and such an awesome team that truly actually do miss those meetings. But, uh, sorry, I get off off track there. Yeah, so sorry, what was your question?

Debra Chantry-Taylor  15:32

Well, you said it was one of the things that you actually loved as they normally visionaries are not very fond of meetings. But with EOS as a single a level 10 meeting, it gets brought in just for those who don’t know, it’s always the same day, same time, same agenda starts on time ends on time. And people go, how can you have a meeting every week that has exactly the same agenda, and that can’t work. And yet every client I’ve ever worked with, starts implementing it, and then goes, this is the best tool ever. So I’m just wanting to hear your experience of that.

Kyle Heebner  16:01

Yeah, so so true, because we would have consistent meetings prior to us. And we’re somewhat organized. A little bit OCD. But yeah, awesome. person was charged with that. Yes, you make a good sheet. But it’d be this list. And we probably see me I get off topic, fairly easy. But yeah, we get off topic. And like, Oh, crap, two hours in this meeting, we have this huge list on our bunch of bullet points we’re supposed to discuss and get on. And yeah, then then going into the level 10. Set up the way EOS sets it up is like, yeah, do your five, five minutes intro and just like we did here at the beginning, with you know, the good things are happening business personal. But yeah, just very, very organized in that sense of the five minutes here, five minutes there 30 minutes, with the deeper discussions, etc. And yeah, just that that organization, especially with the, you know, the scorecard. And, and tracking, tracking the goal type areas, and that’s huge, too, and just keeping that keeping that accountability for all of us, including myself, but all the staff think it was just a key piece and different as compared to how we were, how we were operating or functioning before.

Debra Chantry-Taylor  17:39

Yeah, I was a key part of the level 10 meeting is their scorecard those rocks, how are we doing? You know, are we on track? Are we off track? And I think that, again, people say, Well, you know, we’re looking at the numbers every week do we need to, but it’s really invaluable. I feel in terms of you can very quickly see where things are working or not working. And it gives you a chance to get on top of it before it gets out of control. Yeah. Okay, so so I’m really intrigued, because I know that you had Scott as your implementer, which I’m very envious of, by the way, because I love Scott, he’s been an amazing influence on my life as well. But what why EOS? Like why did you suddenly decide that you needed something like EOS?

Kyle Heebner  18:18

Yeah, you know, what I had? I had coach, you know, previously, through smaller companies. And we’re through SBA. And that’s a that’s a federal kind of thing here in the States. Small, Small Business Association. And, you know, they had a really good course. Yeah, like leadership course. And, you know, pretty, pretty fantastic. And I learned a lot from that. And then yet, I didn’t have a coach. And that no complaints. Coach. Yeah, just, you know, we’re got to where I guess we need to be. And I was, like, yes, pulling forward. And, again, I forget exactly. If we’re just researching on the web, or if someone told me about it, but EOS once, once I saw that name out there. Yeah, I started researching it. And a nice person within the company, and they connected me with Scott. And yeah, that was a January while we connect in 2021. I’m sorry. 2020. And then January or February 2021. We had our first team meeting. Yeah.

Debra Chantry-Taylor  19:39

Excellent. And so So what was it that you know, appealed? Because if you’re already working with a coach, what was it that appealed to you about EOS? Why did you decide to to make that switch?

Kyle Heebner  19:50

No, I think and not just us, but I think Scott, also the implementer I think just some of the discussions I had with him. help move that forward. Yeah. So I got to hear some of his business background, where, you know, he had some technology, specifically for an educational system weighs a little bit. Yeah, just feel the discussions I had with him. I was like, Yeah, I think I think this could be a good fit.

Debra Chantry-Taylor  20:31

And what do you think has been the sort of biggest learning if you like, through working with Scott over that time?

Kyle Heebner  20:40

Biggest learning piece? It’s a good question. I’d probably have to, I probably have to go back to the whole visionary, integrator, yes. And just implementing that, that whole process. And it’s such a key piece.

Debra Chantry-Taylor  21:01

And I think, you know, I’ve worked with a number of businesses over the years natural EOS, and I think that when, when a real visionary sees that there is this seat that they can have, where they can actually do the stuff they love, and get rid of let go of all the other stuff that they don’t enjoy. It’s sort of a huge weight off their shoulders. In some respects, that doesn’t mean that letting go is easy, because we all know that we’re a bit of a control freak as well, as well as entrepreneurs. But once you can get the right people in the right seats and let go, suddenly, your life gets back to doing the stuff that you really are passionate about, and that you can enjoy. And you have somebody who’s there by your side to kind of help you through it. And that’s that whole visionary integrator piece really, isn’t it?

Kyle Heebner  21:41

It is. It is and that’s yeah, that’s what Scott, that’s what he was always pushing for too. Yeah. Kyle, can you hand this off? Scott? No, I can’t. Yeah, I can’t do it yet. But, uh, yeah, just just that it pushed to your gradually, you know, get, again, took the hats off it off the play. So you are able to gradually, you know, focus on what you want to focus on as a business owner.

Debra Chantry-Taylor  22:13

But you have to have the right people in the right seats, don’t you? I mean, you, you can only really let go when you’ve got those right. People in the right seats doing the right thing?

Kyle Heebner  22:22

Yeah, exactly. And I feel it’s probably Yeah, was bringing challenges. I feel that’s probably the biggest challenge was with us as a whole whole company, just hiring and getting the right people in the right seats. And getting people. Overall, I think most businesses are having issues with that around the past two or so years.

Debra Chantry-Taylor  22:49

So how do you make sure you get the right people? What’s the what’s your method? And hmm, to get the right people?

Kyle Heebner  22:56

You don’t want that? Yeah, I wish I had. Yeah, nice, clear answer to step one, step two steps three, but I would say that here’s my thought on that is just with the hiring process, put the time into it. Because we all know how much it costs to hire someone, and how much it cost then to need to discontinue or fire somebody or whatever it may be. Fire someone and then go back to the starting point again. So I feel just taking that taking that time in multiple interviews, or multiple interview process before hiring. To get that feeling, will that work every time? Definitely not. Not every time. But I feel that if you go through the process, and let’s say more difficult, but for the new hire more of a challenging hiring process, where it’s like, oh, I didn’t get the job yet. Okay with them. Do this, this this? Yeah, I feel that is probably one key piece to that process.

Debra Chantry-Taylor  24:14

And you’re testing for the core values throughout that process, aren’t you because it’s over. CV are fantastic. And you can say whatever you like in a CV, but by doing those multiple interviews, you’re actually trying to see if that person shares your core values of where they fit in with the organization.

Kyle Heebner  24:30

Exactly. In building that relationship, and and even before they’re hired again, yeah, it’s not possible to really know, know, the person but yeah, just getting to the maximum possible point. You can see if they do fit in with your values. Show it’s been it’s been a few months, already. Yes, it’s since I sold it and went through the transition. Process. Values and like ding ding ding there. Yeah.

Debra Chantry-Taylor  25:07

I can see, we were already thinking about the next venture, which is really cool. Hey, am I gonna I want to finish up because we’ve got we’re running out of time. But I would love you to give me sort of three top tips or tools that you’ve because you know, as you said, this this journey, it’s not a smooth journey, right? There’s ups and downs that it’s, it’s fantastic when you get there. And you can either sell or go into the role that you really want to do. But what would be the three things that you could share with people listening that they can actually use in their business?

Kyle Heebner  25:35

Mm hmm. No, that’s a yes. Yeah. One thing I think of just always remember why you do what you do? Yeah, what got you into the business that you do? And just try, try to keep that passion alive. Try to keep that drive and passion alive. Yeah, I know. It’s not easy. I know. I’ve lost mine. Quite a few times throughout me. Because backwards once you realize, once you get out of that little pit, and back into I love this. I do this. Come on, we gotta go. Yeah, that’s I think that’s, that’s one thing. And, you know, I guess this this kind of goes with it as well. But it just always try not to take money as your priority, or try to prioritize the encounter the money to make money, money, money, and just keep at it. Okay, what what do you love about what you do? And people see that? Yeah, it comes out to you. That joy and the passion you have for whatever it is that you do. Other do what I do help help kids, pediatrics, your mechanic where your construction, whatever you do, and you show that passion? It’s like, yeah, I want to use this company, I will use that person. I feel the, you know, financially, of course, we all we all need to survive financially, and we want to thrive financially. And I feel, you know, having having that positive attitude is loving what you do. I think that leads into thriving financially, if that makes sense. Perfect. So and I know it’s probably it’s probably kind of steal it from you. But also, you know, we never stop learning. And I know, it’s a big caveat. I heard you say that. And yeah, always slow down. And always listen to people around you, and being in business, listening to your staff asking them question instead of us just blabbing away and sit down, relax, listen to what they’re saying. Because we also learn so much from our staff, our team. And that leads into helping us with decision making as well. That kind of went out there. But yeah, never stop worrying.

Debra Chantry-Taylor  28:18

Yeah,  it’s actually it’s one of my things. I actually have a little tattoo that is a it’s a Chinese symbol. And it basically says that, yeah, I’m sometimes a mentor, but always a student. And that is my mantra in life. Because, you know, we always learning Yeah.

Kyle Heebner  28:33

Very, very cool. Debra were we able to see the tattoo?

Debra Chantry-Taylor  28:38

No, no. number of reasons. First of all, it’s in a very private place, but secondly, it says, it’s in white ink. So it’s actually more like a watermark on a piece of paper than it is sort of a really obvious tattoo but yeah, it’s just something to me.

Kyle Heebner  28:54

No, it’s super cool to ask you

Debra Chantry-Taylor  28:58

Now, my my listeners a bit more about me than they thought they were going to it’s hey, look, it’s been an absolute pleasure talking to you a couple of things. If they wanted to get hold of the HM therapy Support what is your website? How do we get ahold of you there

Kyle Heebner  29:18

You know what being we sold it Yeah, the website is of course website site still out there. Yep. So yeah, I want to see it company bought me is stepping stones group. I want to see success. Yeah, I plan on when I know all my staff are in a good place. Yeah, I plan on really cutting down the hours. So I’m back to being a visionary. Yeah. But yeah, I don’t want to completely step out because yes, is my company in with this much larger organization. I want to see them succeed. And so my email and it still goes into their company. The email system now but kyle@ You know, I forgot her

Debra Chantry-Taylor  30:13


Kyle Heebner  30:13

Yeah. Well love to anybody has any questions or suggestions. I’d love to hear from people.

Debra Chantry-Taylor  30:20

And I’m, personally, I’m really looking forward to seeing what’s coming next. I know that you’re not going to be not quite ready for that yet. But I just know that, you know, as a visionary, there’s going to be a million things going around in that brain of yours. I can’t wait to see what you actually do next. But hey, from from my point of view, Congratulations for everything that you’ve achieved. You know, well done on building up the business on the sale. On on learning, you know about your journey as a visionary. Yeah, Congratulations!

Kyle Heebner  30:46

Yeah. Thank you so much, Debra. Yeah. Thank you for having me. On, you’re awesome show and yeah, maybe I’ll get invited again.

Debra Chantry-Taylor  30:57

I’m looking definitely you’re on my list. You’re never going to escape. I will not. Thank you so much. I’m gonna leave you to enjoy the rest of your week. But yeah, thank you for your time, and I’ll I look forward to following you with interest.

Kyle Heebner  31:12

All right. Thank you, Debra. Take care.

Debra Chantry-Taylor  31:15

You too.



Debra Chantry-Taylor 

Professional EOS Implementer | Entrepreneurial Leadership & Business Coach | Business Owner

#betterbusinessbetterlife #entrepreneur #leadership #eosimplementer #professionaleosimplementer #entrepreneurialbusinesscoach

Professional EOS Implementer New Zealand

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